How Many Wireless Zones Are On A Lyric Alarm System?

By all means, you can always use a separate/dedicated Z-Wave controller. That should not necessarily affect the decision of which alarm system you are best suited for. I always recommend getting the best alarm system that fits your needs. Then you can use a primary HA controller for your primary use of Z-wave devices. The benefit of the Lyric is that it supports all the new RF features on the security side of things. You can always decide to use the Lyric as a secondary Z-Wave controller to simply enroll the same devices primarily controlled by your HA. The value here is that you can optimize automated scenes, rules and scheduling based on security actions. Essentially you do not need to choose the alarm system as the primary controller. However it is nice to have the integration since you will be using the security system daily. It is convenient to use system operations or user actions as trigger points for simple scenes. Then use the primary HA system for the more advanced if/then conditional logic scenes.

Thanks for the ongoing conversation. I appreciate you telling it based on your experience as a tech. I am def. going with sensors on the 433 frequency regardless of which system I go for. I would hang out a bit longer for this lyric, but it looks like the limitations that I speak of (address by Sterling, below-conditional logic) will keep me on the path of a traditional panel interfaced with a separate/dedicated HA controller.

The questions you are asking are justified as far as Z-Wave being up to par. However the reality is that 5800 series and the new SiX series Honeywell sensors have far more reliable RF communications. They have longer range (200 - 300+ nominal feet) and less frequently drop off the receiver. These are just realities that I have experienced as a technician. Now, why is Z-Wave technology inferior when it comes to this? It is a somewhat new technology and does not require the type of rigorous testing and standards from that of security sensors. The real topic here is liability and the Z-Wave alliance is not meeting the same standards as Honeywell since they simply do not have to. Now that may change as Z-Wave tech gets more integrated with security panels over time. For now, that is why Honeywell stays away from Z-Wave sensors. Also, I would be curious to know if Z-Wave sensors meet UL-listed standards which most alarm installs will require for insurance credits. The Lyric panel is set to release sometime in late March/early April. You can always elect to only enroll in central station monitoring if you are not interested in interactive services like Total Connect 2.0. That is a choice you can make when activating service with your monitoring company. We offer standalone central station with our Bronze plan for $15 per month with no contract nor fees: https://www.alarmgrid.com/monitoring "Other self-contained systems often have limitations on zones and device compatibility-this is my main concern with going with something like this. Any thoughts?" Here is an FAQ on how many zones the Lyric will support: https://www.alarmgrid.com/faq/how-many-wireless-zones-are-on-a-lyric-controller-alarm-system I am not sure what you mean by "device compatibility." The Lyric will support any Honeywell 5800 series and SiX series wireless sensors.

Most Z-Wave products are consumer grade (sold in retail stores). Most alarm systems are professional grade (sold through dealers). Alarm systems/products go through rigorous testing (UL, FM, etc) before they ever make it to market as their is big liability in the industry. While Z-Wave technology is improving, it's not quite to the level of reliability needed for the security industry other than as a means for adding extra features to a system. That doesn't mean a consumer grade Z-Wave based alarm system wouldn't be the right fit for you but if you want a true professional alarm system, I don't think you'll find any that are Z-Wave based for the actual security sensors.

Thanks again for the response. I'm on-board with using an actual security vensors sensors if it means reliability, I was just making the point that how could z-wave have been successful with what their existing offering with so many different equipment companies if it wasn't up to par with the industry standards? As far as the z-wave progression, this is what I was referring to: http://www.sigmadesigns.com/news/sigma-designs-announces-advanced-iot-security-measures-for-the-smart-home/ Who knows how long it will be before it makes it mainstream, but interesting non the less. So I do not know if this has been asked or was stated already somewhere, but do you know when this Lyric security/HA system will be available for purchase? Also, do you know if this can be used for local HA purposes only. Meaning, I would like external burglar and fire monitoring, but do not want the HA piece out in the cloud somewhere-I would rather it all be contained locally. (For privacy and redundancy). Other self-contained systems often have limitations on zones and device compatibility-this is my main concern with going with something like this. Any thoughts?

Again you bring up some interesting points. First of all the SiX sensors that will be released with the Lyric will use bi-directional 2.4GHz RF and offer 128-bit AES encryption. They did this to offer more wireless security. As to your point about regarding Z-Wave devices being "commonly produced and adopted," I just dont see how that relates to the tech's reliability. I deal with enrolling Z-Wave and 5800 series devices all day. Hands down the 5800 series RF technology is more reliable when it comes to initial enrollment and long-term supervision. Z-Wave has shorter ranges and we see more drops in supervision. Now with all that said, Honeywell is a business that strives to make money. Just like any proprietary technology, there are larger motives outside of money. If this was an open source technology like Z-Wave Honeywell would be forced to test hundreds of products that rarely meet any universal standards of testing or research. I will have to do some more research on Z-Wave device encryption. Honestly, I just do not know much about that. That is the problem with Z-Wave. Some manufactures do a great job (i.e. Linear) but others fall short. The result of this is that the end user has a poor experience with the Honeywell controller or alarm system. Guess who they blame? More often than not, it is Honeywell. I guess my point is that Honeywell has to delicately balance their brand image as well as the reliability and functionality of their systems. Although I see your general point about proprietary technology being a form of coerced business, I do not think it applies here. Also, there is nothing to prevent you from picking up any Z-Wave hub and setting up a secondary system with Z-wave sensors.

Thanks Frank. I understand what you are saying and have seen the same sentiment said elsewhere. While this might have been true before, I do not necessarily think it is still the case now. I am pretty sure the latest zwave are using 256bit AES now. Where as a lot of the older, proprietary stuff is using WEP 128 and other easily defeated algorithms. Also, how could they be so commonly produced and adopted if they were that unreliable? People would be sending them back. I think it is more to do with security vendors wanting to manopolize. I can get a z-wave door sensor for about half the price of say a dsc 2 way. Just saying!

This is a great question. Honeywell will continue only offer support for Z-wave control devices like switches, thermostats, locks and relays. They will most likely never expand automation integration to Z-wave technology. The reason why peripheral sensors will most likely never support Z-wave is because the technology is not nearly as reliable or secure as the 5800 series or SiX RF technologies. For this reason, Honeywell's alarm systems are more reliable as a whole and will produce less false alarms. The rise in false alarms is a major nationwide concern for police departments and cities; especially those with tight budgets.

Will this support z-wave security sensors (motion,door/window. etc?). It might sound like a stupid question, but a lot of the alarms i've seen (regular control panels and self-contained units) either have limitations to hvac, lighting and locks or just a limited amount of wireless zones, riles setup, Thanks!

It will support up to 6 thermostats and it doesn't have that conditional logic yet but it does support firmware upgrades and may support that type of functionality in the future.

How many Z-Wave thermostats does this support? Also can we do more with Z-Wave programing? Such as using the PIR to turn on a light in a room for X amount of time.